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Small boat and Titanic same problem!

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hardchines
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Re: Small boat and Titanic same problem!

Postby hardchines » June 10th, 2017, 11:38 pm

As far as handling into your docks with wind , and in some cases currents from tides and or river flow, I have been there :captain2: , my dock space at my yacht club on the Hudson river was fully exposed to the river, tides and the river flowed 23 hours a day. Big windage on boats play a part but so does hull shape , my boat had a substantial keel that would take you the way the tide was flowing, north if tide was coming in or south when tide was going out, my boat was oriented East west, tides north south! unless the wind was realy blowing, the tide flow ruled, over my many years of boating and docking and watching others dock I have some suggestions you may want to consider to lower the stress of docking!

I see captains overload themselves by constant adjustments to throttles and shifters and helm while the boat is blowing past that slot he wants to back into. We all have different docks that may demand tons of fussing to get into, but in many cases I see PIT ( pilot induced turbulence), I will always try to set up my boat in docking configuration just like pilots are taught to put their aircraft in landing configuration, when a pilot is on short final to land , he does not need to be fussing with lots of configuration controls , nor does a boater need to be try to adjust variables as he is about to dock!

A normal docking routine, dead slow to dockage space, past space if wind on bow but not too far, now in neutral ,center helm, place throttles in high idle rpm (inboards can shift at high rpm without damage) if the winds are blowing higher rpm, if low breeze less but still high (this is for gas motors), now I face back of boat , i never turn around while docking, I try never to touch the helm or throttles once I face aft, I hold both shift levers and do not let them go until I am in the spot or I decide to abort, I am willing to abort, don't make a bad situation real bad by banging up your boat or your neighbors boat, just be a good pilot and GO AROUND!

too many people go past their dock too far, they do a great job turning their boat so they can back in to their slip as the wind blows them to the slip, but he finds himself going so fast sideways he usually gets his stern barely in and his bow is still heading on by (sound familiar)

If your boat has single levers , that helps most of the time if you don't over control, if you don't have them and you have two stations, you may want to consider electronic single lever controls, they are great but not cheap. Bow thruster helps but a poor boat handler will still have his problems and maybe more as he is trying to figure how to fuss with more controls.

Ok not for the beginner, I watched a feller dock next to me in high winds one day many years ago, I was so impressed that I bought him a cold one after he got his 46 Pacemaker tied up next to my 41 CC Commander, we talked at length about his routine, I have now used his routine more times that I can remember, as follows.

lets say long row of boats both side at a dock, wind coming at 90 degrees to your spot, instead of bow into the wind and going past your dock, I back into the wind up between the rows of boats, as I get to my slot I rotate at speed, 90 degrees and head for the slip never stopping stern in, if all goes well I am at lest half way into my slip and my bow is still going past spot into the wind (momentum), as it stops I continue backing in, the wind never gets the bow moving before I am in my spot. I practiced docking allot in open water. This routine works best with diesels in my opinion, I back up at about 5 mph before I rotate with my shifters only without changing throttles, its not hard but knowing your boats handling characteristics is a must.

Told you I am long winded! :captain:

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Re: Small boat and Titanic same problem!

Postby km1125 » June 11th, 2017, 10:04 am

I did read your "small boat big project" thread. I didn't realize this was the boat we were talking about!

Now the cruise speed makes sense. Now I don't recall in that thread if you had discussed weight distribution and not having ENOUGH weight at the stern with all the modifications. How did that end up turning out? Did you end up with a similar "sit" to the hull after all the modifications, or is it perhaps more bow-heavy that a stock hull?
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Topic author United States of America
hardchines
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Re: Small boat and Titanic same problem!

Postby hardchines » June 11th, 2017, 7:19 pm

km, the boat has gained about 1900 lbs,I did weigh all major components coming in and out, the pounds going in just kept on adding up, AC ,gen, heat, new custom laminate decking in cabin is a good example, small area but added over 100 lbs! even the fuel tank weighs over 200 lbs more when full compared to when full of gas, her draft is about 3 1/2 inches more then before.
I did all I could to increase her stability by keeping all added weight as low as possible, I added 100lbs of ballast on port side aft in engine room to offset 200 lb gen set on std side, i also added a 15 gal fresh water tank on port side outboard of the fuel tank that adds another 130lbs to finish the gen weight offset. A 34 gallon black water holding tank on port side adds about 300 lbs when close to full, I did add 400 lbs of lead ballast under the cabin deck spread for and aft on center line.

Keep in mind this is a small boat with a 8 foot beam and a fly bridge, I would say the boat is allot more stable now then when I bought her, she sits level and looks proper in the water, I am very happy with the way she turned out, have not had her in any real sloppy conditions yet but close to pretty sloppy, felt better then I expected especially with a following sea.

If things work out, my 2018 ICW trip to Florida and the Bahamas will introduce me to her personality and sweet spots and not so sweet spots on the water.

I have been in conditions on my 20 foot Grady that I wished I was on my 41 Commander and other times on my Commander and wished I was on my Grady!

Thx for asking Km

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Re: Small boat and Titanic same problem!

Postby Viper » June 12th, 2017, 6:49 am

hardchines wrote:Source of the post..... her draft is about 3 1/2 inches more then before.....

Is the top narrow section of your transom assembly still above water? How much of it can you see?
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Topic author United States of America
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Re: Small boat and Titanic same problem!

Postby hardchines » June 12th, 2017, 12:01 pm

Viper , yes I have about 5 inches above water level ! photos to follow
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Topic author United States of America
hardchines
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Re: Small boat and Titanic same problem!

Postby hardchines » June 12th, 2017, 5:55 pm

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Re: Small boat and Titanic same problem!

Postby tomschauer » June 12th, 2017, 6:29 pm

its most likely an optical illusion, but that looks like a standard rotation prop on a counter rotation drive.
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Topic author United States of America
hardchines
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Re: Small boat and Titanic same problem!

Postby hardchines » June 12th, 2017, 7:21 pm

Tom good eye!!!, must have been counter rotation then the lower half of drive was changed to standard rotation!

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Re: Small boat and Titanic same problem!

Postby Viper » June 12th, 2017, 7:51 pm

hardchines wrote:Source of the post Tom good eye!!!, must have been counter rotation then the lower half of drive was changed to standard rotation!

I see that too, unless they just labeled the drive wrong because I'm not seeing a serial number on the label and it looks like this was a retrofit from what used to be a different drive according to the pattern on the transom.

You definitely need to confirm that you have a the proper rotation prop on there to match drive rotation. For a single engine app, it should be standard rotation (right hand) though anything is possible after a retrofit so don't assume.

I take it there was no transom assembly work done like bellows or gimbal bearing?

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Re: Small boat and Titanic same problem!

Postby tomschauer » June 12th, 2017, 11:08 pm

Hardchines, I assume you have verified it actually turns clockwise when in forward gear. If not, it could explain some of your handling issues. With a single engine, it of course, doesn't matter if you have standard or counter rotation, so long as you have the proper corresponding rotation prop.

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